Registered on your site here to reflect on what a killer awesome time I had on your server yesterday. I was playing with a group of friends on your server and the map was Kharg Island. New map loaded up right when I logged in and I grabbed the Little Bird. I’ve got a pretty great connection so typically I can snag the vehicles right out of the gate at match start! Lucky right? Since I beat everyone to the punch on the helicopter a lot of people jumped into the passenger seats for the ride.
I know the drill though, I’m not going to trap these guys in the chopper so the first thing I head for is the B flag across the water to drop anyone off that doesn’t want to sit side seat for me. Over comms with my squadmates they tell me they’re advancing armor down the main road and I relay my drop off to them and swing back towards “A” flag to support. Near the main smoke stack I see an enemy attack chopper ranging in on the armor column. I point my nose at him with laser designation as he fires his ECMs. I stick with him however because I know that jam isn’t going to last very long and he’s unwisely staying in the same airspace.
Despite blaring alarms in my own cockpit I maintain a bead on the enemy chopper and successfully lock, launching a guided rocket at the last moment and dipping in a dive to the earth. My ordnance lands accurately and I get a double kill on the chopper! I see death messages come across my feed for Kawasss and nrkRISE. Swooping down below radar I’m still getting locked which clues me in that it’s not a stinger or ground targets so I shout to my squadmates, “I have an air target locking me!” hoping for some input from the ground. Pulling a quick 180 and tilting up I spot the enemy scout chopper hot on my tail and unload with the chainguns.
Sparks fly off his hull as he continues attempting a lock against my ECM to no avail. To heavily damaged to maintain control the scout chopper goes careening into a gas pipeline with the occupants bailing at the last moment. Proud that I’ve managed to take down all the enemy primary air support I begin moving up towards C flag from A to support the armor push with the rest of my squadmates. I spot two ground troops on the beach side of C and pitch forward to begin a strafing run on C.
Fade to black. You have been kicked for “ping”. I’m sure it had nothing to do with me just killing an admin. Or taking down all the choppers 60 seconds into the game.
So just a quick question: What’s an appropriate ping that won’t get me kicked for killing an admin?
Look forward to your answer!
Your story is great, but I somehow doubt that you were actually kicked for killing an admin. To assume this you've got to assume that the admin/s are corrupt/kick people who do good to improve their own chances, we have no reason to assume this. I get kicked out of lots of servers randomly for "timing out" which is either on my end or theirs, it pisses me off, sure; but it's not really anyone's fault.
Was rolling a video. Here's me getting kicked for "ping".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2VWNjo4RkA
Again, great gameplay, you're a damn good player, and I sympathize, I get pissed too when I get kicked randomly like that when I'm doing well due to ping/connection/timing out. However, you still don't have any reason to believe that you were kicked for a malicious reason.
All we've got so far is your assertion that the "ping" reason was really just a cover for kicking you since you killed an admin. The questions that pop up in my head are: what reason have you to believe this and why do you jump to this conclusion?
I'm not trying to be protective here, I just don't see what reason you have to jump to this conclusion beyond suspicion/frustration.
From the recording I can't see a reason, although only looked quickly as its early. No your game disconnected message came up so couldn't see the reason.
I highly doubt you were kicked by Admin for good gameplay and certainly not for killing an Admin, because thats just bad form. If I were to kick a player every time I'm killed on our server it would be empty lol.
Either was We'll look into this for you and get it resolved.
Reasons I suspect:
1.) My ping was not bad rendering the reason I was kicked false.
2.) My friends who frequent the server immediately asked after I was kicked "Did you kill RISE?" and telling me he has a history of that. I have no other indication that he's an admin and by you guys not denying it I'm assuming my friends are correct.
3.) As you can see from the video, I wast not lagging, I was first in the chopper, and my ping was low enough to blow everyone out of the sky. All indicative of a more than sufficient connection.
As you can see from the video, I was clearly being a productive and effective team player so there were no behavior reasons for the kick. You can look at the logs and verify that was my first and last time on the server. I was not using the chat box. I was not lagging. I was not breaking any of your behavior rules. My conclusion that I was kicked for killing the admin is deduced because its the only plausible explanation.
I'll let you and Deth Jesta sort it out as I have no real authority on the matter, but from what reasons you've got, that doesn't sound like the most plausible explanation, the most plausible or likely explanation is a sudden jump in ping or a timeout type error which happens to everyone.
You added the detail that your friends told you he has a history of kicking people in that manner, and as of now that's the only reason for believing that rather than a random jump in ping or a timeout error. You have every reason to believe it's a random timeout/jump in ping error by default, your one reason is definitely a reason to be concerned/wary/ and that's something the rest involved can work out on their own.
However, that doesn't make it the only plausible explanation. As I said, the default assumption should always be that it's a random glitch/timeout in connection/ping jump/any other random reason non-malicious, so in order to remove the default assumption as a plausible explanation you have to prove beyond doubt that you were kicked maliciously. Why such a stringent standard? Since the default assumption is the usual and most likely cause for these kinds of events.
The reasons "my ping/connection seemed good" and "he has a history of that" combined are a reason to be concerned, but those two reasons together do not make it the only plausible explanation, far from it.
out of curiosity, how is the ping-kicker calculated?
I know there has been some lag with procon since the server updates. is it possible that its disabled during map-changes (as players may have high pings here, but it doesnt matter), then re-enabled 60seconds into the map?
because if procon somehow lagged, and caused the map-change-disabled-region to come at the wrong time, it may have flagged your ping as high, tried to kick you, but the procon lag meant you were kicked a few minutes after this.
Yeah this is what I mean, since there are contingencies and possibilities like Tower mentioned here, it's best to make the default assumption before we make accusations concretely or the "only plausible explanation".
As you can hear from the video I was kicked for "ping". The video didn't record my browser because its set to record the game. From the time when I was actively play to the time when I said "I was kicked for ping" was less than a second.
You should have logs regarding your admin activity. You should see it was a manual kick. You should also see from the video the "ping" kick was unwarranted. I've said all I can say and your logs will say the rest.
But I understand, nothing is going to probably happen . You'll probably let this slide or your other admins are guilty of the same thing. I know how these types of BF3 severs work. You're there to make sure you and your friends have fun.
quite frankly, I don't like your attitude. perhaps we should have started this conversation with something along the lines of 'Sorry you didnt enjoy yourself', and this could have progressed with out the incessant attack.
I don't like the fact that you instantly rule out that it wasnt a dodgey plugin. Every server update that gets dropped causes issues with plugins. Teambalance can go crazy, due to server->procon lag, and randomly switch players for no reasons. DICE are terrible at implementing things that are required
These plugins are there to help promote teamplay, and the side-effects can be terrible... but 95% of the time they work and influence an interesting gameplay
As DethJesta has said, the matter is being investigated.
I'm pretty new to The Mighty (forums & clan) altho I have played on their servers since release. But if I had a senior position, and the ability to investigate & sort out what happened, this is what i would do:
If it was admin-power abuse, heads would roll. Its not in The Mighty's interest to have admins abusing powers.
If it turned out to be a dodgey plugin, I would thank you for informing us (a problem we dont know about is a problem we cant fix), sort the issue out. Then i would send you on your way with a perm-ban for your attitude here.
however, i dont have any seniority here.
Either way, thank you for informing us of this issue.
We are sorry for the inconvenience that this caused you.
The matter is currently being investigated.
We will inform you of our findings, and what we plan to do about it.
As you can hear from the video I was kicked for "ping". The video didn't record my browser because its set to record the game. From the time when I was actively play to the time when I said "I was kicked for ping" was less than a second.
You should have logs regarding your admin activity. You should see it was a manual kick. You should also see from the video the "ping" kick was unwarranted. I've said all I can say and your logs will say the rest.
But I understand, nothing is going to probably happen . You'll probably let this slide or your other admins are guilty of the same thing. I know how these types of BF3 severs work. You're there to make sure you and your friends have fun.
First, Tower you're probably right. I apologize if my first response seemed overly hostile/skeptical.
As I said, the fact that it appeared that you had a good connection doesn't rule out a non-malicious possibility, it only makes a malicious kick an unlikely possibility.
Even with the astounding amount of false presumption you've made, it's being investigated anyway. I'm pointing out that you don't really have any reason to assume what you're saying 100%. What you should've said was "hey guys I got kicked randomly for ping but that kinda thing happens so it's fine. It was after I killed an admin however and after I was kicked my friends said he has a history of doing that. It's probably nothing and I have no reason to accuse anyone but I figured I'd notify you." Then we'd thank you and look into it.
You didn't say that since you came in here with the attitude: "They're all corrupt and just want to protect their friends" What reason have you to assume this about us? None. If you really believe that, I would wonder why you came in to notify us at all.
Finally had time to look into this and have checked the logs.
I'm going to appologise to you CitizenAlphaCNN for being kicked, due to not being warned beforehand that your ping was too high. Since I can't see a ping value for you on your recording and the BF3 server doesn't report out ping values for its players, I can only go on what the recording and logs show. They do look like they were a rage kick by admin, but without a ping value I can't say for sure. In defense of admins in general not just this server, our job policing servers is very tough, due to the lack of decent tools available, I wont go into that here as its a whole different thread.
I will be making sure that ALL the server admins are aware that thier powers are not for abuse, but to keep the server a fun and balanced place for all to play. And if I'm made aware of anything like this is the future access levels will be reduced of removed. This is the first instance of potential admin abuse I have been made aware of in the 5 months that we have been running the server.
The admins have been given permission to kick for high pings if they see them as it does effect the server and gameplay for other players, due to the way that DICE have poorly coded the game. This range is about 200-250 ping, which tbh is alot and anything over 50 is open to packet loss. I will be adding this to the server rules as its currently not advertised to avoid potential confusion in the future.
I have also checked and it was just a kick not a tempban or fullban, so you have not been stopped from comming onto the server since. I would like you to rethink your " I know how these types of BF3 severs work " comment as this is most certainly NOT the way this server is designed to be run. I have put in a very large amount of work into getting it popular and running it in a fair and unbiased way, despite DICE/EA's best efforts to cripple the community.
As long as you are not breaking the rules to the server and generally getting stuck into the action with teamplay then you are more than welcome. I hope to see you back on the server with no hard feelings from both sides of this :]
Thanks guys for the stalwart defense of the server, although maybe alittle too enthusiastic on this occasion ;]
@ Towerfull ... the last time I read up on the ping kicking plugins they basically ping an address from Procon to get a base ping ( eg. www.google.co.uk) and then it pings the players to work out their ping. Not accurate enough for me to use tbh, so been waiting for DICE to add ping reporting since hmm ever...maybe R22. You can find more info on the Phogue.net website which is where Procon and its plugions come from.
I've run my fair share of games servers and I understand the stresses inherent and I appreciate the time you took to look into it. I understand these types of issues need a few accounts of abuse and typically need rarely obtainable evidence by the player so I'm not "out for blood" here, rather just making you aware you have an abuse issue festering.
I'll give the server another go and hope my time lasts more than 1 minute and 30 seconds.
@JUB JUB: I ruled out an automated kick for ping by a plugin for the following reasons:
1.) The kick was too immediate to assume it was a kick induced by a lag spike. A proper ping plugin would accommodate for brief variations in ping which is normal in all internet connections.
2.) The kick message featured poor grammar indicative of a manual kick.
Servers with poorly programmed plugins would not be populated for very long. I've got about 10 years web development experience under my belt so I've come accustomed to noticing automation such as this.
hahaha i so remember the vid so yes iv kicked u for ping u killing me only gave me time to check ping my from all players at start as always so sry for ur vid ur ping was like 300 if i remember
didnt read all the post at first so yes i personnaly kicked u for ping causz it was 300 for about 1m or more
above 200 i usualy kicked
love the " did u kill RISE " hahahah i assure u you can kill me again and again i wont kick u it just give me time to check players on server
as long as u respect rules otherwise yes ill be honored to kick u lol
but yes u and your fellow americans friends come often but u usualy have bad ping and i try to keep server clean
hope u understand and come back gay laser guided little bird lol
First and foremost, I had a lot of trouble trying to decipher what you're trying to say. I'm assuming English isn't your first language so maybe a bit got lost in translation. What I got from this:
You seem highly amused at abuse accusations against you. You don't seem at all phased that you have developed a reputation for that among regulars to the server. As a matter of fact you said you "love" that. You belittle my gameplay style, which ironically proved effective against you. Finally, the only reason I came back to this thread after considering the matter acceptably resolved by Deth Jesta was your frequent in game chat insisting I come and read your response.
Admins are supposed to be mature voices of unbiased reason who facilitate a server to ensure everyone is treated respectfully, playing according to rules set forth, and handle technical aspects of maintaining the server.
I won't bother arguing this unwarranted kick further. I said my piece, presented my facts, and made my case as much as I feel is needed. All that being brought forth and taking your response into consideration it is easy to conclude: you are a terrible admin and you should in no way be given administrative rights.
-_- i think ur taking that the wrong way
Which part? Feel free to elaborate.
ok ill admit i didn't warn u ,but if i had to warn every one w high ping i couldn't play the game !
i check players ping every time i die
i look ping s evolution thru all the round and if i see no amelioration i kick
so yes ur ping was high , high for more than a minute (if i remender grand bazar was before and u had ping the hole round) so its not a lag spike
i would like the know the hole story behind the " did u kill rise " ^^ lol
what else u need to know ? !
1.) I joined your server during a map change, I have never played your server before that point. Your logs will verify this. The video documents as you can see by the flag caps the first 1-2 minutes of the match.
2.) When I killed you it was your first death. By your own words you check during deaths ping rates. My kill would of been the first time you checked.
3.) You were flying/gunning a helicopter when I killed you, meaning with respawn times and the position of your helicopter (well into the middle of the map coming FROM my team's side of the map) indicates you started the match in the helicopter. There's no way you could of monitored the ping rates of 63 other players.
4.) I ping your server between 90-150 with any "spike" in ping hitting max of 150-160. My ping was low enough during the match to kill both of your helicopters. This ping, while not perfect, is well within your accepted ranges as stated by your head admin and no where near what you claim. I would happily livestream pinging your server in battlelog to prove this fact.
5.) I have played on your server after this incident with no lag issues. As a matter of fact my first game back after you kicked me I jumped in and played Grand Bazaar as a sniper and went 12/1 while your own head admin was in the game. No ping kick occurred. No warning issued.
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/battlereport/show/30421 256/1/354831287/
Bottom line: There is no feasible way for you to establish history and no justification behind you kick. You screwed up and you're trying to lie your way out of it.
Finally the whole story behind "did you kill rise" is exactly that. I got kicked. Over vent someone asked "Did you kill rise?" I checked the video and I did kill you. I asked my friend about you and he said, "He tends to do that." and in all fairness he did say you were attentive when there were issues however you had a "history of shady behavior such as this". My friends are based out of Europe, I'm the only one in the group that is American.
*sigh*
Alpha, you havent ever stated what you want. You clearly have an agenda, and you are tearing anyone apart that can't guess it.
The matter has been looked into, and he has apologised. We have all shown concern, and indicate that we are for fair gaming.
What do you want to have happen?
How can we make you feel like you have accomplished what it is that you came here to achieve?
I'm sorry for the confusion but earlier I stated:
Finally, the only reason I came back to this thread after considering the matter acceptably resolved by Deth Jesta was your (nrkRISE) frequent in game chat insisting I come and read your response.
I have no agenda other then not being lied to.
So how can we make you feel like you have achieved something here?
Basically, it seems like this argument could go on for weeks. If we set a target, then someone can call first blood.
I wanted to make it known of nrkRISE's admin abuse and I did. So I stopped visiting the thread. Then nrkRISE called it back to my attention by repeatedly messaging me to in game.
Calling attention to the matter was all I really initially hoped to achieve and I understand anything I say or do is not going to make him lie any less or improve him as an admin. I will not hesitate to raise the bullshit flag whenever needed which your mistaking for some other agenda.
So I turn the question to you guys, why did you call me back here if I considered the matter resolved?
i believe in Illuminati
I believe there is no rule about kicking player for high ping.